(08-17-2017, 12:19 PM)Makween Wrote: I'd suggest that you look up what a strawman argument is. Failing that, read what my post actually said.

We don't know if these men were Muslim or not. What you're saying is that they were definitely practising Muslims because they were of Pakistani descent. While a Muslim cultural heritage can be assumed, that does not imply that they were practising Muslims.

I'll reiterate another part of my post for the hard of thinking - their shared ethnic-national heritage is relevant, and questions should absolutely be asked about potential cultural determinations behind their crimes. Women are treated terribly in Pakistan, and that translates to many Pakistani post-immigrant communities. It isn't as simple as 'well it's because they're Muslim'; you just have to look at the example of Indonesia to see that.

Reducing the discussion to 'Muslims bad' actually prevents a proper exploration of what is clearly a very serious issue. That's a problem - unless, of course, you couldn't care less about the victims and are just appropriating the news story to further your anti-Muslim agenda. Given your history of boasting about woman-beating, I think I have an idea as to which camp you fall into.

Sorry if that's too nuanced to fit in with your need to caricature everyone who disagrees with you as a 'PC brigade lefty who is denying THE TROOTH'.


My mum won't be marching alongside fascists. Will yours?

Who reduced this to "Muslims - bad"? 

I didn't - quite the opposite in fact if you go back and read what I said. So you've just made that up.

Also where did I call you a PC lefty brigade who is denying the trooth ? Oh I didn't - you just made that up as well - well done you. I see a pattern here.

History of boasting about women beating ? Where is this ? Feel free to enlighten me as you've just made that up as well. Certainly a strong pattern emerging here with your patter.

And what exactly is the example of Indonesia meant to show ? I'm truly interested. Enlighten me. I have actually been to Indonesia. I also know they have religious police there who go around the place looking for unwed couples who dare to spend time together and even dare to hold hands. They are then put in the back of a wagon and taken away for whatever punishment they are deserved of. 

So if you are trying to hold up Indonesia as some sort of "nicely" run Muslim country then you had best probably try and pick another one.

If you have anything I can actually debate with feel free to respond. More nonsense I can just pick apart without raising a heartbeat is entirely boring.

Please try harder.

(08-17-2017, 12:52 PM)7FootPlaysTheFlute Wrote: He said none of it would've happened if the people hadn't charged in with clubs and shit.

I really don't need to go looking for his exact quotes to prove a point m8 it's Donald trump.  You're trying to argue here on a technicality.  It's quite clear that Trump feels somewhat aligned with the people who were marching with the KKK and Nazi flags.

See he was having a go at the people for pulling down the statue too.  No acknowledgement of why the people felt that they had to do that, no acknowledgement it was offensive to a large portion of the country.  Just that there's these people trying to squash "muh American freedoms".

The fact that he can't distinguish between George Washington and Robert e Lee is just ridiculous too.  Absolute mess of a man.

No way !! How dare the leader of a country say the public shouldn't just go around ripping down things they don't like !!!

(08-17-2017, 03:36 PM)i8hibsh Wrote: Turn your phone off and have a drink with your family man!

I don't think the chimps are allowed bevvy ?

Seems the KKK are expanding their horizons. Barcelona now. They get around these guys.

Everyone beware. 

(08-17-2017, 04:10 PM)Coppercrutch Wrote: No way !! How dare the leader of a country say the public shouldn't just go around ripping down things they don't like !!!

Did you read the rest of my post?

I don't think pulling down the statues is the best way to go about it either but there was no acknowledgement of why the people were angry, which is completely justified. There's way more to the situation than people pulling a statue down.

Watching all the neo-Nazis flailing about like the pathetic cunts they are

(08-17-2017, 04:29 PM)7FootPlaysTheFlute Wrote: Did you read the rest of my post?

I don't think pulling down the statues is the best way to go about it either but there was no acknowledgement of why the people were angry, which is completely justified.  There's way more to the situation than people pulling a statue down.

Yes I read it all. Why should he have to make a more general statement when he's taking about general destruction of property ? 

I'm not a Trump fan. But I do think the way every single little thing he says or does it twisted in as many ways as possible is pretty lame.

He came out and said it wasn't acceptable for this to happen.

He also came out and condoned the KKK etc.

He also came out and said both sides of this event were to blame.

Now people have had issue with timing of these things. But that's grasping at straws imo. I really can't see from what he's said that's got everyone in such a hissy fit. 

It's being ramped up. And many are falling for it.

Falling for it? Who's orchestrating this?

Condoning the KKK would be a big deal

(08-17-2017, 04:18 PM)Coppercrutch Wrote: Seems the KKK are expanding their horizons. Barcelona now. They get around these guys.

Everyone beware. 

Media not releasing descriptions of the attackers, that means they aren't white.

(08-17-2017, 04:52 PM)Stanthejambo Wrote: Media not releasing descriptions of the attackers, that means they aren't white.

It has been described as a terror attack, not a lone wolf with mental illness.

Where does that leave your wee theory?

(08-17-2017, 12:30 PM)Makween Wrote:

This says everything about you and nothing about me.

nahh, it was about your way with words. You ruled out the religious option for him, threw in an excuse (cultural) leaving the only possible answer for him or his ilk to reply that - They're brown british of south asian descent. ergo they're women hating bheasts preying on our white vulnerable lassies. re-read your response - in a nutshell. You made excuses and left the only rebuttal door open to him, which would have been clearly labelled Racist.

I'm passed caring what colour or religion they are. It's 2017 and humans are still needlessly killing each other.

I don't think we will ever be able to eradicate it completely as killing is ingrained somewhat in human nature, at least for a tiny minority of people.

What concerns me most of all is state sponsored murder and mass terrorism carried out by western democracies. I'm not justifying the barbaric acts by these individuals, however I also accept that we have caused a great portion of the Muslim world equal amounts of needless violence and suffering.

(08-17-2017, 04:58 PM)pondlife Wrote: nahh, it was about your way with words.  You ruled out the religious option for him, threw in an excuse (cultural) leaving the only possible answer for him or his ilk to reply that - They're brown british of south asian descent. ergo they're women hating bheasts preying on our white vulnerable lassies.  re-read your response - in a nutshell.  You made excuses and left the only rebuttal door open to him, which would have been clearly labelled Racist.

The culture of much of these countries IS Islam. 

I don't get folk who can't see the link.

(08-17-2017, 05:05 PM)Coppercrutch Wrote: The culture of much of these countries IS Islam. 

I didn't want to get involved, but 'the culture is Islam'?

Is the culture of Britain Christianity?

(08-17-2017, 04:43 PM)2Nafferty Wrote: Falling for it? Who's orchestrating this?

I don't think there's a bloke sitting there with a white cat pressing buttons surrounded by sharks. But there is a strong correlation in the output and beliefs of a number of western governments and media. It's not exactly subtle. 

It's a belief. They are right - if anyone else disagrees they need to be re educated or shut down.

Look at the media. Obama = good. Trump = bad.

Based on what ? Obama was in power for two terms and is widely thought of as having done very little. Yes Trump says some nuts things - but he's really done very little - if anything - in his time in charge to get these labels of done rabid racist Nazi. There just isn't any evidence of this.

But the media and other governments can't get enough of firing into him.

I'm sure some of that is revenge due to his stance on the media in general. But on that subject I think he has a very good point.

(08-17-2017, 04:54 PM)Alan Partridge Wrote: It has been described as a terror attack, not a lone wolf with mental illness.

Where does that leave your wee theory?

Well when it's been already widely circulated that there was more than one attacker,.......

(08-17-2017, 04:54 PM)Alan Partridge Wrote: It has been described as a terror attack, not a lone wolf with mental illness.

Where does that leave your wee theory?

I'm sure the mental health angle will get trotted out.

They weren't just ordinary vandals spray painting "Acey is a fagot" on the side of a bin ffs.

He's made these people (who I think are wrong) out to be just as bad as the fucking nazis and claiming it'll be Washington statues to come down next. No idea if he realises the confederates opposed pretty much everything America claims to stand for today, probably not.

You can choose to see things as black and white if you want though, destruction of property Guess those British and American troops that pulled the saddam statues down were just as bad as the Nazis too